What's Up, Forum? (personal message from Marilyn)

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Post by admin » Tue Apr 27, 2004 10:34 am

Thank you for your appreciation of my role, Marilyn.

You made an important point that has baffled me for years, however. That is the general reluctance of Haitians to support each other in a meaningful way. Oftentimes, we appear to have rather developed an expertise in prosecuting each other. We can readily think of many among us who strive for notoriety by throwing bricks in lieu of posing them to achieve something worthwhile and durable. I would like to see that change in my lifetime.

You have heard the saying: "Depi nan Ginen, nèg rayi nèg," which is of course a very negative saying. Jafrikayiti, on the other hand, likes to remind us that "Depi nan Ginen, bon nèg ap ede nèg." Of course, both of these sayings have their applicability. I much prefer the second, but I often have to wonder which one of the two more closely reflects our reality as a people.

In any case, I welcome your expression of s
upport, though I wish it were not so personal. Hopefully, you will get some validation for coming out so strongly in support of Windows on Haiti and Ann Pale. As of this week, we are six years strong and getting ready for first grade. A long way to go...


thank you Marilyn

Post by Caroline » Tue Apr 27, 2004 9:31 pm

I appreciate your post but I'm not sure what to say except thank you. And of course thanks to Guy for everything he has done... I remember when Guy was first putting this website together. I had the priviledge of meeting him face to face one afternoon in Port-au-Prince and it was a huge honor for me.

Depi nan ginen... that is a really sad proverb, isn't it? And when I think of the situation in Haiti and what might seem to some like an inability of the Haitian people to achieve real solidarity I get so angry. But not at the Haitian people. I get angry at the multi-national, corporate sponsored ,neo-colonialist, anti-democratic terrorist whore nation (the United States Empire) that has worn the people down, usurped the power of any true democratic leader in Haiti, trained murders and despots all over Latin America and the Caribbean, and prevented any real progress in Haiti or the Haitian people. I do not, will NOT b
elieve that the people are intrinsically incapable of putting their heads together. How could we believe that when we take Haiti's history into account? But like Guatamala, Panama, Mexico, El Salvador, Nicaragua, Brazil, Columbia, Equador, Peru,... (oh, need I go on?).... maybe we should just say virtually ever nation on this side of the PLANET. Like all the other nations under the foot of the american Empire (multi-national corporations), small groups of people are massacred, raped, stripped of their rights, libery, health, LIFE, land, resources and anything and everything that could either be profitable to the Man or get in the way of His plundering, is pretty much wiped out in any way possible.

That's what I think has happened to the Haitian people's innate ability to forge a strong, united force. I think its been sucked out of them by the neo-colonialist monster. I think their road has been blocked at every turn. I think they've been kicked down, kept down and walked on for so long that t
hey are beginning to forget what they were fighting for in the first place.

I read a little bit about an indigenous Amazonian group that was practically wiped out by disease during the Spanish Invasion. No matter what they did, they couldn't figure out why people were dying because this wasn't thier disease... they didn't recognize it. It was white man's disease. But they didn't know that. All they knew is they were dying. So after a while of moving from place to place, changing life ways, losing all their wise elders, they began to look at each other and point fingers -- "maybe this is *your* fault"... "no, I think its YOURS." The society began to breakdown full force then. They turned against each other and eventually became known as one of the most vicious violent tribes of the Americas.

They weren't like that in the beginning... not at all.

I think that's real similar to the problems in forming solidarity in Haiti (and abroad). Many Haitians I meet don't even think t
he overthrow of Aristide had anything to do with the U.S.. and many of the ones who do think Bush did them a favor. Oh Lord, can you imagine how hard that is for me to HEAR? But more and more I am convinced that there are many Haitians in Haiti who really dont even know that it was the Bush regime that tied Aristides' hands in the first place... they are disallusioned with their government or the situation in Haiti, they are embarassed, etc... little do they know that's just what the Bush thugs wanted!

And oh how that is reinforced here in the U.S. press! "Haiti fatigue" they call it. Right. As if they didn't cook it up in their own damn kitchen.

That's just a bit of what I think and I am very very thankful to have a place I can say it.

And Guy -- thank you!




Marilyn et al.....

Post by Caroline » Wed Apr 28, 2004 5:42 pm

Once again, thank you for your posts and for this forum.

I believe its high time that we, as thinking people, stopped worrying about whether or not the things that need to be said are offensive. I, for one, am sick up to here (neck high) of mincing words. I mean -- PEOPLE ARE DYING.

I got into this discussion on campus today. A friend and I were talking about Haiti and Iraq and the Bush regime and we were joined by a couple of other people who piped in with, "Yeah but the United States is the best country in the world -- look at how good we have it!"

Oh Lord... did I pop a cork. I said how I SEE how "good" we have it and so does just about any other covey of THIEVES and RAPISTS who go around taking what is not theirs. I said the reason we have so much to THROW AWAY is because our government makes good and ~!#@#!$ sure that we are the ONLY country on this side of the globe that has a working democracy.
And what kind of democracy is THAT, pray tell. This country is not self sufficient! If the U.S. had to give up all their sweat shops and banana plantations in Latin America and the Caribbean... if we had to stop sucking oil out of the Amazon... if we had to let the democratically elected leaders of all those countries actually rule and lead their people to independence... this country would fall flat as a pancake. Or maybe we'd all have to start living like human beings instead of gluttonous whoremongers.

Oh, then the whole debate took off like wildfire. But it was GOOD. People don't know about the things we do. They didn't know about what the Bush administration did in Haiti... But they do NOW because I made sure of that.

One man kept saying, "I hear ya BUT..." I'd ask if they knew about the demonstrators in Haiti whose bodies turned up in that little area of Port-au-Prince. "Yeah, I hear ya BUT..." on and on. I finally said, "NO YOU DON"T HEAR ME."" "Yeah I do but..." I sai
d, "No you do NOT hear me... if you heard me... if you REALLY heard what I was saying you would have backed up... your eyes would have flown open and you would be waving your hands around right now saying, 'WHAT??? WHAT??? you mean our government paid known war criminals to overthrow a democratically elected president?! You mean demonstrators are being SLAUGHTERED??? WHAT? WHAT??? OH MY GOD!!!" That's what you'd be saying if you really HEARD me.

When on WHEN are as a people going to ask ourselves what our government is doing out there in the international forum that has made us a target for "terrorism"???? Why are we not asking these questions?

Well, Marilyn you are an inspiration to me and I think we ALL should start asking these questions and as often as we get a chance. Who CARES if people think we're rabble rousers? Who CARES as long as it opens ONE person's eyes? Not ME. I don't care any more because I don't think we can afford to care.

I don't know what it's like
to stand in the middle of 75 or a hundred dead bodies of people whose lives were snuffed out because they opened their mouths. But I know what it's like to be looked at funny or criticized and argued with and I know its not anything that will keep me awake at night. But keeping my mouth shut is no longer an option. I made the mistake of educating myself to the real truth of what kind of a world we live in and now my comfortable days are all gone. And I intend to run my big mouth until I draw my last breath.

And my reputation is probably going to hell in a hand basket but I don't care about that any more either. It doesn't seem the least bit important when I compare it to the horror of walking among a sea of cadavers to try and find what's left of someone you love.

Okay, now that I've had my rant. I think this topic could be counted as politics because it has to do with forming solidarity and that's where reform starts. Political changes really don't matter if the change doesn
't reach the social level too -- and that's where we are.



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New forum category

Post by admin » Wed Apr 28, 2004 7:39 pm

Caroline, much respect!

Once in a while, ranting is good for the soul and you can do it right here. I don't know if the category name fits, but Marilyn and you have defined it with your posts. the word "politics" would restrict it too much. This is the space to be... real.

It is not a pity party and it does not have to be sad, though the circumstances will make it a sad place sometimes. More importantly, it is a space where you could let it all hang out (no cuss words necessary). Your language is so powerful anyway, who needs cuss words? I just wonder if the power of your individual expressions may not cause some spontaneous combustion... Well, we can see how far this will take us, because after all, it is... risky business.

No cut and paste here. Just the raw and the real. The references will be your eyes, your ears, your heart, your brain, your experience, your life. And if ot
hers don't like it... they can take a hike.

Welcome, sister.


Post by Caroline » Thu Apr 29, 2004 10:42 pm


I just got in from a very long, emotionally trying day. Things have been rough since I returned to the U.S. from that trip to Haiti on April 1st. Soon after my arrival I found out that, while I was in Haiti with all my husband's little children, toting them to the embassy to get their visas, he was very cozy in our home, in our room, in our bed... *with my best friend*. Ha --- April Fool's Day indeed!

Okay, that's personal but I'm not a very private person and never have been. I just say that to point out that these are trying times for me personally and in other things I care about like the situation in Haiti.

Anyhow, I just got home. It was a long day. I had a final exam this morning. Family issues with estranged husband (who I still love for some stupid reason!). And I decided to check the forum before I turned in for the night.

I gotta say... your post was so encouraging for me, especially at this p
articular moment. Thank you so much for your kind words and your reference to me as "sister." I am more honored by that than words can express.

The human spirit is an amazing thing and that's one reason I love Haiti so much -- because of the amazing soul of the Haitian people. What a long road they've been down and still, they DANCE!

Inspiring, isn't it???

Peace to you and yours,


Post by » Thu Feb 03, 2005 11:07 am

Let's keep talking. Is the forum still as relevant to you all today as it was a year ago?

Leonel JB

Post by Leonel JB » Fri Feb 04, 2005 4:44 am

Personnally, I'm still alive and reading posts on a daily basis.

I understand that it is hard for some people to write or take part on any forum after a hard day of work. But, take it from me, everyone is welcome here. We are one RACE, THE HUMAN RACE.

Our differences should not be a barrier to block our Brotherhood. Windows on Haiti is for everyone who respects one another. Don't feel threatened, if you a Republican, Democrat, Lavalas, Duvalierist, Apaidist etc.

By the way, I would love to hear the rational from Apaid or Latortue concerning the actual situation in Haiti. I know for sure there's a lot of other people reading WOH. But,they are afraid to participate.

Please, Brothers and Sisters, we have a lot to talk about. I bet you, we will discuss respectfully on different issues. Haiti needs us to reach a common ground.



L*union Fait la Force*

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