The Secret of the Rich White Men? (in the Bible)

[Leonel Jean-Baptiste*]

If we look around the World, we would see White Men so rich, they don't even know what to do with money. Closer to us in the US we have thousands of them. In England which seems to dominate the world in terms of former and new Colonies by its very strong currency where his citizens are buying lands all over the World.

We also have France, Italy and Spain where Rich White Men are getting richer on a daily basis. So rich, that even their great great sons can have money to waste for a lifetime.

The big question is, how do they get so rich? Where did they get their money?

One of their answers arethat they work so hard for it! I have no problem with that. But, why is it that all of them have one obvious thing in common <Their ethnicity>?

Even in a country like South Africa where a majority of Blacks are in Power, the people who are living lavishly or expensively are <Whites>!!

A lot of these privileged people are wearing their jewelries with expensive diamonds from the Motherland. They are driving very costly luxurious and sportcars with the blood of Brothers and Sisters in their tank. Meanwhile, People of other Ethnicities are dying from hunger and other diseases.

Now, what make them so different beside their ethnicity?

Well, one thing for sure, They do not believe in GOD! We can also say that they do not believe in the Afterlife!

Unfortunately, us, Poor People, We believe in the Almighty, the Omnipotent,the Merciful GOD! The one who tells us, LE ROYAUME DES CIEUX NOUS APPARTIENT. En d'autre termes: Si ou pase mizè sou tè a, lè w mouri ou pwal nan SYEL.-

Who came up with this brainwashing? Well, this is the Secret of the Rich White Men who started these Lies with the Natives. They continued it with our Forefathers during Slavery where they made Fortune. and passed it on to US (Little Us).

Well how do we stop this cycle?

Si w ap manje on manje ki gonfle w tout tan, ou better chèche on lòt manje, paske wa gen kakarel.

I know it is hard to break the Gospel of the Rich People. But, try, because, God did not Create US. We (Human) created God!

Subconsciously we are feeding our permanent brain defect (excuse my French). We are part of the Great Cycle of life. We eat everything in sight, just to be eaten at the end by some tiny creatures and so on. What they call the Soul does not exist. How come a baby does not have Soul or the soul is not developed?

Live Life, Enjoy Life, be careful of the Rich White Men telling You that they Are Born-Again Christians when they are killing Millions for their Natural Ressources. Which by the way is against the teaching of the Great Revolutionary Jesus. His teachings were of Brotherhood of Mankind. Half of his teachings are not really taught purposely for their contents against the brainwashing of the POOR...

Think Harder, be a player not a Toy.

Leonel's Gospel

[guysanto*]

Leonel, I completely lost your train of thought when you said: "How come a baby does not have Soul or the soul is not developed?"

Either the soul exists or it does not.

It it does not exist, then the question is superfluous.

If it exists, then everyone has it, including babies (and perhaps non-humans too; Humans love the idea of exclusivity!) I have not heard any Christian or non-Christian (Jew or Muslim) claim that babies do not have souls. The better question is: When does the soul come about: at the instant of conception or some magical time thereafter?

Another is: If the soul comes about at conception, that gives fertility specialists some extraordinarily God-like powers, does not it? They can at once <start> dozens of souls, discard all but one or two souls, put some souls on ice, in some cases, freeze the soul or its development for a few years, select the souls they want for reasons of their own, etc.

Of course, people will say: Guy, your question does not make sense. You are equating the embyo and the soul, two very different concepts. And I will respond in asking them when exactly one separates those two concepts in their own brand of theology.

Fertility specialists have to perform hundreds of tiny abortions in a day's work! How does the Church assert its teachings in those circumstances?

Can tiny "souls/lives" be violated in favor of "state of the art" medically viable ones?

Or is the soul a viable concept, only at the end of the first, second, or third trimester of pregnancy? To take this thought to its logical end, would the soul only come about when the new baby makes it way through the vaginal canal or is pulled out of its mother's belly through C-section?

And what about in-vitro fertilization? Is the soul in-vitro too or not?

And what will happen when scientists will inevitably perform human cloning (unless runaway global warming or nuclear war put an end to scientific progress first)? Will they be cloning the souls too or will they have created new ones (or perhaps, partially new?)

I'd like to see Gelin answer those questions for me. He is a biologist/geneticist and he generally finds answers to all of life's questions in the Bible.

Mwen ta renmen konnen sa Tayi, Anacaona, Shelony, Nekita, Pauline, Jaf, Bouli, Jonas, Jean-Marie, Marilyn elatriye panse sou koze sa yo tou...

[Leonel Jean-Baptiste*]

Guy, I would like to answer your question. But, I wanted to tease a little the great philosophers like Plato who declared that every Human has a Soul. The separation of Body and Soul is done at the End...

I wanted to show, based on theair teachings, the expansion or Maturity of the Soul which in my opinion is flawed.

Believe me, I didn't want You to get confused. Gelin, Maybe...

leonel

[Gelin*]

...I'd like to see Gelin answer those questions for me. He is a biologist/geneticist and he generally finds answers to all of life's questions in the Bible...

M bwè pwa. I do not have a specific answer to those questions. I know that may not satisfy you and you'll most likely come back to haunt me again.... :( Let me wait and see...

gelin

[Leonel Jean-Baptiste*]

NEg lakay, apa w fE lach.

Di nou sa w panse? Bondye pap fache ake ou frEm.

leonel

[Gelin*]

leonel papa,

ou pa gen dwa anmède yon byeneme konsa non...:-)

Se vre m pa gen repons sou kesyon sa yo. Opinyon m genyen yo voye m sou plis kesyon toujou e m gendwa paka jwenn repons pou yo. Annatandan, nou vire sijè ou te vle devlope a. Retounen sou li ankò si posib.

gelin

[T-dodo]

Monchè Guy,

Sou kesyon reilijion, mwen pa gen sifizaman evidans pou m diskite li. Mwen tèlman bwè pwa, mèm enterè m pa genyen pou m al chèche konnen sa ki deja konnen. Sepandan, mwen te renmen kesyon ke Leonel pose yo. Preske tankou sa Gelin te di an, yo anmègde lespri m.

Jean-Marie

[Gelin*]

If we look around the World, we would see White Men so rich, they don't even know what to do with money...

And there are ways to explain that:

1- There is the funny idea that Whites are way at the top of the evolutionary ladder, with the Black Africans jumping in the middle between the supreme specimen and the monkeys. It goes something like this: EVOLUTION::arrow: monkey black light white.......Oooops!

2- But that's not all. If you happen to believe in CREATION and in the Bible, well, there is something for you also: Man was created white but became black as a result of a divine curse........Pfft.

Whichever way you look at it somebody is the winner. Guess who...

gelin

[Frantz*]

If we look around the World, we would see White Men so rich, they don't even know what to do with money.

Not difficult at all. Think positively, believe in your power to overcome obstacles, set achievable goals, work hard, learn to pull our resources among ourselves, assume risks with intelligence and we'll get there. Don't be distracted by the rich white men world. Have we tried hard enough?

Frantz

[Frantz*]

Think Harder, be a player not a Toy.

Right on! we will add: work intelligently harder. It's time for us to be conscious of our ability to compete and be winners. You are correct Leonel, we should change our diet ... if we want to stop the ''kakarel''. For us, believers, it is never enough to pray God, it is our duty to assume responsibilities by being active players.

frantz

[jafrikayiti*]

Anmwey ! I have been so immersed in politics for the last months that I completely missed this thread.

1) What does 500 years represent in human history? I ask this question to put into perspective, Leonel's observations about the Rich White Men. In other words, this material domination of the Rich White Man is a rather recent phenomenon in human history and I don't find it necessary to look for supernatural explanation for something so recent and whose history is known to us. We live in a period where the conquest of lands and peoples was achieved by Europeans in a very systematic and successful manner. Various parts of the world have known episodes of conquests (Japanese, Chinese, Nubian, Egyptian, Moorish, Phenician, Roman...). However, from 1492 to the present time there are two characteristics of the conquest which led to the current situation: it is racial (white supremacist) and it is global.

2) The role played by the Christian religion (Bible, missionaries etc...) is complementary to that played by the military and the merchants. The three "M"s work in tandem. First the missionaries enter with the military. They prepare the way for the merchants to complete the take over. So, if the Christian religion is yet another form of guns, the racist adaptation of stories like the curse of Cham etc.. are as many bullets used to destroy the soul of the conquered people.

3) The soul of babies.....well, I keep finding that Gélin and I have much more in common than I used to believe. Also a student of the Science of Life (Biologist), and also quite willing to admit that on this particular matter, my only honest answer can be "m konnen m pa konnen!". There is too much about me that I have not been able to figure out. When did I begin to be? How come i don't remember when I was in my mother's womb?


And, why does Guy always like to ask these questions for which he offers no answer.... you see...so many mysteries to keep our souls - or is it just a brain? busy until the next conquest.......

Jaf

[jafrikayiti*]

Kouman pawòl la di: "En parlant du boeuf, voila sa queue..."?

Les Aborigènes accusent la Reine Elizabeth II

EN L’ABSENCE D’UN TEXTE RECONNAISSANT L’"INJUSTICE" DE LEUR CONDITION DEPUIS L’INVASION DE L’AUSTRALIE, LES ABORIGÈNES VEULENT POURSUIVRE LA REINE D’ANGLETERRE POUR GENOCIDE.

http://www.africamaat.com/article.php3?id_article=619

Article Nouvel Obs

L’envahissement de l’Australie par la Grande-Bretagne en 1788 reste une plaie ouverte pour les Aborigènes.
Une centaine d’entre eux ont menacé lundi 13 mars à Melbourne (sud) de poursuivre la reine d’Angleterre Elizabeth II pour génocide.
Cette annonce fait suite au constat de l’absence d’un texte reconnaissant l’"injustice" de la condition des Aborigènes depuis l’"invasion" britannique.
Les manifestants ont établi un campement à une centaine de mètres des quartiers de la reine qui doit officiellement ouvrir mercredi 15 mars à Melbourne les Jeux du Commonwealth (15-26 mars).

"La tentative de génocide, passée et actuelle, contre la population aborigène d’Australie n’a pas éteint nos droits souverains dans notre pays", a déclaré leur représentant, Robbie Thorpe.
Les protestataires ont symboliquement allumé une flamme sur leur site baptisé "le camp de la Souveraineté" autour duquel ils souhaitent convier la reine pour régler la question "à travers la négociation".

A l’heure du thé
Il n’a pas détaillé la façon dont la justice serait saisie si leur requête était rejetée.
"Il n’entre pas dans nos intentions de voir la reine traduite devant les tribunaux internationaux comme Saddam Hussein", a ajouté Robbie Thorpe affirmant vouloir "inviter la reine à venir s’asseoir pour parler et prendre une tasse de thé". "L’heure est à la réconciliation et nous voulons initier ce processus", a-t-il dit.

Les protestataires ont également prévu une marche dans la ville, mercredi, à l’occasion du coup d’envoi des jeux. Représentant à peine 2% de la population, les Aborigènes sont les laissés-pour-compte de l’Australie, avec des taux d’alcoolisme, de chômage, de suicide et de violences domestiques largement supérieurs à ceux des autres habitants. Leur espérance de vie est de 20 ans inférieure.
La reine Elizabeth II est chef du Commonwealth, une association de 53 pays anglophones (totalement ou partiellement) et indépendants regroupant la Grande-Bretagne et la plupart de ses anciennes colonies, soit 1,8 milliard de personnes.

[Caroline]

I agree with so much of leonel's post. Especially the part about the religion of greed having nothing to do with the message of the revolutionary Jesus.

Rich white men. <sigh> I just this past month moved from my lovely little apartment in a very culturally diverse neighborhood of Kansas City to the upscale side of town to be closer to my job and my kids. I have culture shock already! People don't speak to each other, the cars are all spiffy (jaguars and such), the streets are all perfect, you can take your grocery carts all the way out to your car, and you don't have to prepay your gas! You can go for a walk at night and I'd guess that less than 1% of the people over here have ever even met someone who has lost a young relative to violent crime. And guess what else? Of course, everybody here is WHITE. It's so boring. Everybody over here is so 'well behaved'!

Rich White men indeed. They bore me to death.

My philosophy on why they are rich has to do with the rise of agriculture (greed) about 10,000 years ago. Human's were Black first (I believe) and as we left Africa we lost a whole bunch of stuff. Then came the idea of planting more crops than you need and hording them. Agriculture. With that came greed and all the rest of it. On to Colonialism and the current economic neo colonialist Empire we live with today.

They're rich because they're thieves. And they do it all in the name of God.

It's crazy how easy it is to convince some people that emperialism and christianity are the same thing. Kinda like 9/11 and Iraq. It's more propaganda to maintain status quo in this Machiavellian hell they've created. And keeping a large percentage of the world's population in poverty is a vital link to maintaining this world order. The Rich White man has to stay on top or his whole dispicable glass house will come falling down around his ears. They learned a long time ago that religion is a great tool and they've twisted the message so far that the very people who practice the religion can't even see that the words they read in their own book are exactly opposed to the stance they are taking.

It's nuts.

But I'm just ranting. I should be in bed.

[Frantz*]

I believe we have a pretty good idea about the world we are living in. After reading the above posts , I came to the conclusion that we all should be doing much more to break the statu quo. Denouncing the "white greed" or "white supremacy behavior" is, of course, correct but is that enough?

Granted the whites have economic power to suppress others, but what are we proposing to break the impasse and move forward?

Are we organizing ourselves collectively to uplift our spirits and create our space if not our own world? Öur own world? Yes, I mean it.

We can begin by understanding our community , challenging our minds to raise the consciousness level of its citizens and encourage them to become members of community based organizations whose goals are to develop logical thoughts and translate them into economic and social actions that would ultimately benefit our * "one obvious thing in common", our "Ethnicity".

* "Think Harder, be a player not a Toy" {* Leonel}

Frantz

[Leonel Jean-Baptiste*]

Frantzou and Caroline, I read something the other day. It stated that in the early twentieth Century, England had colonized about one third of the World!!!

Remember that I spoke about a strong currency. On top of it, they influenced at least one third of the World. From the Caribbean, to North America, from Africa to Asia... No wonder reparation is not a good word!

Now, let's go and check the Vatican??? This is taboo! They are responsible for so many religious killings with the Crusade. They are responsible for a lot of Protestants moving to the new World! People were burned alive for not agreeing with their Philosophy. In the name of Christianity! Where do they get their Money?

Why is it the story of Mary Magdelene is not really told? Why are they trying to show that a 33 year old Jewish Man didn't have a wife or kids?

By the way, they said that in the last Supper, Jesus' wife was also there, in the real picture by Da Vinci???

Now, if we want to take Genesis where Eve (a woman) had to eat an Apple to show the weaknesses of Women. That same book portrayed Cain as a black man after killing his brother... Like someone stated, history is always being written by the powerful ones. The weakest ones become mute!!!

Rich people can control everything and they are controlling everything. They can trash the World! Meanwhile, they are looking for a better livable planet with our Tax-Dollars to live happily ever after. While ourselves, we will pray God (made by Rich) to get to heaven!

There are people who are paying about 10,000 dollars a night for the Finest things at The Ritz Carlton. While our budget does not even go higher than 5 thousand for the year! but yet, we believe!

In God We Trust! OOps, I meant In Money We trust!

There are some real stories. But, not from the Vatican and their co-Conspirators... Anacaona and Caonabo can tell us how the teachings of Jesus' Gospel only brought them Terror, Lies and Death, MADE BY VATICAN!

Verite sou Tanbou!

Leonel

[Gelin*]

...Why is it the story of Mary Magdelene is not really told? Why are they trying to show that a 33 year old Jewish Man didn't have a wife or kids?

Celibacy was common among religious jews at the time of Jesus.

By the way, they said that in the last Supper, Jesus' wife was also there, in the real picture by Da Vinci???

leonel, you can swallow that lie also if you want. Kouri pou lapli tonbe nan rivyè?

...That same book portrayed Cain as a black man after killing his brother...

False! It's not in the book. Maybe Da Vinci painted him that way...:-)

...Anacaona and Caonabo can tell us how <u>the teachings of Jesus' Gospel</u> only brought them Terror, Lies and Death, MADE BY VATICAN!

False again!!! You can check out Jesus' teaching for yourself to see that it was something else that motivated the conquistadors...

gelin

[Leonel Jean-Baptiste*]

Gelin, remember that average Human did not live to see forty!

Now Gelin, if we talk about real jesus'teachings, it would have been censured by any government where Capitalism exist.

The book said that Jesus was the Son of Mary and ..., Wrong! He was from David and Solomon bloodline which was the real reason of his killing.

On top of it all, He did not make any Miracle. He was a Revolutionary and Philosopher against the status quo...

A papa, manje manje gate, wa gonfle wi!

Now let's go back to the brainwashings through Religion by the Rich. They also used the Poor little White people by talking about their Superiority over any other Race! Just a difference of 0.01 percent can make one Smarter and all. We've been duped! Diviser pour Regner...

Anyway, ban m bay Gelin kOnn nan. On jou tout verite gen pou yo sOti...

Gen on seri de moun ki konprann ke Bondye se Real estate Broker. Li ka bay yo nenpOt tE apre de mil an...

leonel

[Gelin*]

Gelin, remember that average Human did not live to see forty!

Quite the contrary. They used to live longer on average.

Now Gelin, if we talk about real jesus'teachings, it would have been censured by any government where Capitalism exist.

In some way, Jesus' teaching were censored, and that's the reason he was killed. In the first century following the birth of his doctrine, those who became his followers (from any ethnic group) kept his teaching pure; and they, too, were censored, persecuted, tortured and killed. At some point, it was a crime to carry a portion of scriptures (seen as subversive in many places). Ask yourself what happened...

On top of it all, He did not make any Miracle. He was a Revolutionary and Philosopher against the status quo...

According to leonel 1:23.....:-)

gelin

[Leonel Jean-Baptiste*]

leonel jean-baptiste wrote: "Gelin, remember that average Human did not live to see forty!"

Quite the contrary. They used to live longer on average.

Gelin, can you explain why at a time there wasn't any antibiotics and other medicines. At a time where Childbirth was dangerous. But, yet, you think life span was longer?

False again!!! You can check out Jesus' teaching for yourself to see that it was something else that motivated the conquistadors...

When Christopher and his thugs landed on these peaceful countries, they came with a Cross to teach those Savages about Jesus and rob them blindly.

This was decided by the Vatican who, separated the Earth and gave the Northside to the Spaniards and the Southern Part to the Portugese. This was their God-given Rights...

OOPs, it is very close to Presently. For, it is the right of any Powerful Country to spread the Good News by Force and take over the Land that the Real Estate Broker named God gave to his Believers!!!

Gelin, I was born and raised Catholic. I went to Catholic Schools and University. I had to take 3 Theology classes and 3 Philosophy taught by Plato. Then I had to look for the Truth! Guess what? The truth does not come from the bible which is a very Racist Book...

The Truth may be somewhere else, and Poor People are far from knowing it, Car Le Royaume des Cieux est a Eux...

Jesus dit, Je suis la Verite! Tell the Truth!

leonel

[Gelin*]

...Gelin, can you explain why at a time there wasn't any antibiotics and other medicines. At a time where Childbirth was dangerous. But, yet, you think life span was longer?

True that antibiotics were not around yet, but many diseases we have today were not known. And people, in general, were living closer to nature with smaller populations.

When Christopher and his thugs landed on these peaceful countries, they came with a Cross to teach those Savages about Jesus and rob them blindly.

Sure the robbed them blindly but what did they teach them about Jesus? Can people give to others what they don't have for themselves?

Gelin, I was born and raised Catholic. I went to Catholic Schools and University. I had to take 3 Theology classes and 3 Philosophy taught by Plato. Then I had to look for the Truth! Guess what? The truth does not come from the bible which is a very Racist Book...

What does Plato have in common with Jesus? Theology is simply the (organized) opinion of man about God. So, you can study theology all you want and be away from the basic teachings of Jesus-Christ.

The Truth may be somewhere else

I believe the truth is in Jesus, and I believe I have found it...:-)

gelin

[Leonel Jean-Baptiste*]

gelin wrote,

True that antibiotics were not around yet, but many diseases we have today were not known. And people, in general, were living closer to nature with smaller populations.

Gelin papa, are you ok?
Many diseases were not known because they could not be diagnosed.
Do you remember that saying in Haiti, "Entel mouri san malad"?

Well, they were not diagnosed. For, they did not visit a doctor or there were no diagnostic tools in hands.

Gelin, do you really believe that David or Abraham really live Centuries? We can try to prove scientifically that they did not. Based on their nutrition alone, it is easy to challenge it...

Sure they robbed them blindly but what did they teach them about Jesus? Can people give to others what they don't have for themselves?

I believe that they taught them about the same thing that You and I were taught. Jesus, son of Virgin Mary and God who could not ask for a date Himself, had to send a porte-parole (an Angel) to be the "KomisyonE".
A son was was born Decemder 25th which coincides with Isis'son (I believe) in a Barn somewhere in Africa.

He was a tall BLONDE BLUE EYES European. We don't have stories of him being younger. Except, when he was preaching to the older preachers, bla bla bla...

Then, around 30, a virgin Man emerged. Following his mother's footsteps, he stayed a Virgin beside his raging Testosterone...

His first miracle was turning water into wine. No wonder Europeans love wines so much.

Li reveye on moun ki te endispoze, taken for dead! And on and on and on.
Anyway, the Spaniards or Europeans taught the Natives (Indians based on European's mistakes) about Hell and beautiful heaven. Which, I believe that Jaf explained about something that happened in Cuba where the Indian Chief chose Hell over Jesus' Heaven...

Anyway Bien-aime, This is the same story which we all knew. Unless, you've found something else?

In terms of Plato, I did not put him in Theology. He was a Philosopher who followed Jesus' philosophy. he wanted Us to understand Metaphysics which is, Beyond the Physical. He taught us about the Soul or Essence and Substance. He was a student of Aristotle who also shared the same belief.

Now, I think that they share so much in common as Great Philosopher. He (Plato) like Jesus spoke about the separation of the Soul to the Body or Essence to Substance or matter.

Anyway my good Friend, a lot of People share so much with Jesus. A man like David Koresh who declared himself the Son of God. A Charles Manson who had a lot of followers. Charismatic leaders of any religious group share a lot in common with Jesus, beside being Human...

Que la Paix du Seigneur soit toujours avec Vous et avec votre Esprit!

Your honorable, leonel at your service!

[Gelin*]

Gelin, do you really believe that David or Abraham really live Centuries?

It's not in the book.

gelin

[Tayi*]

Hello my friends,

Please accept the prodigal son back! I am not completely back but I could not resist dropping a few lines to say hello and to let you know that I am alive. I am hoping that, with the coming of the end of the semester, I may find some free time (despite taking classes and working during the Summer) to interact more with my cyberspace friends.

I hope to come back with some goodies that we can all enjoy including an article that I found on the transgenderism issue.

I am writing in this particular thread, though, because I want to express my admiration and gratitude to Gelin for his continuing, tireless/sacrificial efforts in keeping the dialogue flowing from a Christian point of view on this forum. Thank you Gelin!

Of course I appreciate all of you who continue to come with questions and challenges or just good conversation.

God bless!
Tayi